Welcome to Messy - Making Sense of Leadership

Loading player...
Ever wonder if leaders really matter in complex organizations?

I’m Daniel Atlin, an executive coach with over 30 years steering Canada’s universities, co-ops, and government sectors. In Messy, I dive into the chaotic world of purpose-driven leadership—think higher education, healthcare, and NGOs. Join me as I talk with global leaders about navigating stakeholder conflicts, geopolitical shifts, and crises, all while balancing influence over authority. It’s raw, it’s real, and it’s not for the faint of heart.

This is Messy - together we'll make sense of the mess
8 Jun 2025 English Canada Management · Society & Culture

Other recent episodes

What others see as messes, some see opportunities | David Agnew

Don't be afraid to try something new. What does it take to lead in systems that are complex, constrained, and constantly changing? Daniel Atlin sits down with David Agnew, President of Seneca Polytechnic, whose career has spanned politics, finance, international development, and higher education. One common is stepping into organisations…
15 Apr 59 min

Putting the Mouth Back into the Body Politic | Sara Hurley

Public Service = Designing Fairness at Scale. In this episode of Messy, Daniel Atlin is joined by Sara Hurley, former Chief Dental Officer for England, a leader whose career spans frontline clinical care, military service, and senior government leadership. Few have operated as consistently at the intersection of individual care,…
25 Mar 56 min

Is the University Model Broken? | Tim Blackman

Rethinking higher education — and finding your purpose. What if the real problem with higher education isn’t funding, technology, or rankings, but the model itself? In this episode, Daniel Atlin speaks with Tim Blackman, former Vice-Chancellor and President of the Open University, about whether the dominant university model is simply…
11 Mar 51 min

Making Sense of Making Sense | Why the mess matters

This episode is different. There’s no guest. It’s just me, Daniel Atlin, answering the question I ask every leader who comes on Messy: to riff off the Kierkegaard quote “Life must be lived forwards, but can only be understood backwards." I look back at the moments that shaped my curiosity…
4 Mar 8 min

Should you Collaborate with the Enemy? | Adam Kahane

If you're not part of the problem, you can't be part of the solution. In this episode of Messy, Daniel Atlin sits down with global facilitator and systems practitioner Adam Kahane to explore what it really means to collaborate when agreement feels impossible. They explore collaboration across deep divides, the…
25 Feb 51 min